Demos and Snipers and Scouts OH MY!

NOTE: Sorry for the bad wizard of oz joke.

 I've been having trouble with these 3 classes lately and I need tips on how to kill them. Also please no generic comments like, ambush. Because if I could ambush 100% of the time I wouldn't be in this mess.

My current setup is- Flamer, Flare gun, and Fireaxe.

DEMO: I find at close range they are easy. It's at medium range which I have problems. I often get a deflect or 2, but they never hit him! Not even a grenade on the floor will damage him. His weapon's arc and firing speed also make it hard to deflect his grenade. I find that if I'm boxed in I can't effectively move his stickies to get to him. This often happens when I don't want to move. (IE: I'm capping a point) Would it be better to rush him THEN cap the point, or just heckle him while capping.

SNIPERS: Surprisingly, these guys dominate me. Not just at long range, but anywhere, and anytime. I don't need any tips at long range.(because snipers should always kill you at long) I just need help at medium. Usually I'm hit with a headshot, and I'm down to 50hp. Chasing after him would make me SMG fodder, and running away would be an easy snipe. I've tried using flames to obscure his vision, but it only works some times. I'm wondering, would it be better to try and hit him with a flare, or obscure vision.

SCOUT: Many a pyro can relate to my scout trouble. And I've found that they are pretty much dead in a semi-open room. Usually when I see a scout I try to get him to back off.(shoot a flare, axe him etc.) But my problem is when they are at medium range when they can just dance around you with their scattergun/pistol.

 All help would be appreciated.

Against Demos: Well, Pyro IS an ambush class, he is not designed for fighting Demomen head-on. But when you get in such a situation, I would suggest you either back off and ambush him later or dogde his grenades, avoid/reflect stickies and shoot him with the flare/shotgun. He probably won't detonate his stickies when you shoot them at his feet. Also when you see that he has to reload, you can rush in.

Against Snipers: Same here: Don't let him see you in an open space, always stay covered... But I would jump around like crazy and use the flare. I never tried to use flames for vision obscuring, but it's not a bad idea. You can also use the shotgun to mess up his aim.

Against Scouts: Don't use the flare. Try to set him on fire with the flamer, but use the shotgun if he doesn't get close. If it's a really good Scout, run away and attack in a small room or so.

For snipers, if he sees you and you see him, try to hit him with the flare till you get in range of the flamer. Or if you're unsure, just hit him with the flare and back off. The flare is Probably a better of way of dealing with snipers than a smokescreen.

Personally

DEMOMAN: use the shotgun if you know you'll be fighting a lot of these in a round. Srsly, it find shotgun about 100x better at killing demoman than any of this other weapons should you be fighting head on. Otherwise try to airbalst, or retreat.

SNIPER: don't let him see you long range, use and abuse your secondary weapon here.

SCOUT: Try to airblast him if at all possible, Other than that shotgun after flaming.

Demo: I've personally found it easier to just dance past as many pipes as possible while reflecting when needed, then when you get close enough to flame try and strafe around to his side so there's less chance of getting hit. With the stickies either start using shotty to break them away, wait for someone else to move over them so they'll trigger them, or just practice pushing them away (dm and duel maps are good for practice)

Sniper: I've found it good to approach sniper fights as pyro the same as if your a spy, creep around in his blind side and catch him from behind, they'll have no chance unless they're near a medkit or get a crits

Scout: Its best to disengage them at a distance, run back around a corner and hope they take the bait and chase you, that way you take a mid range fight to close range. If there is no way to run and hide, pop off some flares and hope for a hit, scouts retreat very quickly after a flare shot I've noticed

Assuming you're playing pub servers, I can help you with demos.

As a demoman, there are 3 situations you find yourself in with a pyro:

1. He follows you in an open area, like the courtyard in dustbowl phase two.

2. You encounter him in a tunnel/choke point

3. He rapes me with his flamethrower by ambushing me at close range.

In situation one, you have an advantage, if you're smart. Do NOT run in a straight line, pipes will eat you for breakfast, considering your range will be compromised because you're running at him and he's going away from you.  Zig, zag, and if you get hit use the shotgun and retreat. At close range I'm not even sure you can reflect pipes because of the airblast lag and pipes firing speed. Anyway, if you get hit by one pipe I KNOW all I have to do is fire a second one and you're done, which is why I say zig zag to avoid being hit. Try to move backward if you get hit as well, because holding W while getting hit makes you stay in the same place, which is where the second pipe comes in. Moving back takes away that hit, though the pipe might go past you so be cautious of that. Like I said, move around. It won't hurt your range that much. Do not take an alternate path once you've engaged the demo in combat, if a pyro chases me and runs around the rocks or whatever I place 4 stickies to seal you in and spam you to death. It's what the demo was made for. Like I said though, you do have an advantage, you'll do fine if you keep yourself hard to hit.

In situation two you are at a very large disadvantage. Choke points are what demos are made for. In any tunnel all I have to do is spam pipes and pretty much any enemy is dead meat, aside from the soldier. I also wouldn't enter a tunnel without making sure I had laid stickies to cover my back in case things got tight. In these situations, be cerebral in how you proceed. Unless it is absolutely crucial that you move through that tunnel right that second I would either wait until the demo grows bored and comes out so you're even, or see to it that you have a medic or teammates because while he does well against hordes, an outnumbered demo is still outnumbered. You should make an effort to take alternate paths. As a pyro you should take the high road anyway because of your ambush advantage. Most demos worth their salt will keep tabs on heavily trafficked area, not one where they can camp and pick off straglers.

In situation 3 the playing field is honestly about even. Thinking dustbowl 3, near BLU's spawn, a pyro jumps out of the shack and starts lighting me ablaze. In these situations I know I'm dead, or that at least if I don't get lucky I'm dead. At that point I will absolutely stop at nothing to take you with me. Seeing as you're in your element and I'm out of mine, your life for mine sound good, I will run around, lace the ground with stickies, and if I know it'll kill you I'll detonate them even if it kills me.

If you're having trouble with the trap aspect of the demo, don't be predictable. Like I said, highly trafficked areas get guarded, not the one nobody expects. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a pyro with a backburner run behind my team twice and goes for a third time but gets taken out by two stickies. That's all it takes. If I suspect you're close, I will lay stickies in the area I expect you to move in. Spawn camping pyros are creatures of habit, one time just recently there was one taking cover near my base and moving for people when they came out. I popped two stickies one the wall near the exit he came out of and took him out instantly.

Sorry for wall of text/tl;dr, but I hope if you take the time to read this it'll help you out. I also apologize for the many errors in this post, I'm not running off a lot of sleep.

Sounds like you need to ditch the flare for the shotty.

yeap =]

Quote:
Well yes and no. The flare just requires slightly different tactics.

Mibbok, when using the flaregun try thinking of the pyro as more of a "hit-and-run/support" class. Watch for spies and keep an eye on your medics. With the shotgun you can afford to be more aggressive but with the flare try being more laid back.

Also don't axe scouts unless its for giggles.

For sniper since I play that a lot. What I hate the most is pyros that use their shotguns while running at me. Make sure to jump up and down as it messes up the hitboxes and makes it a lot harder to headshot you.  And if you are upclose, use the airblast, because a lot of snipers tend to be near walls so it will help kill them easier.