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The Engineer Update
Current problems:
Engineer bases take too
long to set up. This is conducive to not maximizing the engie’s
potential as a team player, because he must set up out of danger.
Maintaining an engineer base is boring.
(Corollary to #2) If engineers leave, the base in in danger of attack/spies.
Spies and Demomen
An engineer’s job has few variations; the class’s play is highly formulaic.
The engineer can be used for griefing/disruptive gameplay. Note this when designing new items
Possible Primary/Secondary/Melee Replacements:
- Shotgun: Nail gun (possibly radioactive)
Hitting an enemy creates a particle effect, which can reveal cloaked spies
Parabolic drop on slugs, similar to needlegun
? As an enemy is hit with more nails, damage effect increases to mini-crit
then full critical
? Radioactivity decreases max health of engineer
Taunt: Engineer removes radioactive slug from tool belt, flips it
like a coin,
and the places it in his nail gun
- Pistol: Taser
On hit, briefly stuns an enemy
? Speed reduction on target
? Damage/no damage
Taunt: Same as pistol taunt
EMP
Has short range
? Disables stickies temporarily
? Disables enemy buildings temporarily
Taunt: Engineer throws grenade up in the air and chuckles menacingly
Designator
Laser pointer-like device that illuminates targets.
Increases range of sentry to a certain extent, allowing the sentry to hit
normally out-of-range targets.
Requires significant charge-up time (possibly aided by dispenser)
? Lights up disguised spies for sentry to target
Taunt: Engineer places device on ground, makes it do a light show, then
does his shotgun taunt dance
Six-shooter
Well-aimed shot can knock a sapper off a building
Slow rate of fire
? No damage falloff
? No critical hit
Taunt: Good candidate for a deadly taunt
- Wrench: [wrench type]
Carries more metal
Upgrades buildings slower
? Speeds up build time more
[wrench type]
Carries less metal
Upgrades buildings faster
? Speeds up build time less
Build PDA- Here have been considered some replacements for the engie’s existing
buildings.
- Sentry: Smart sentry
Intelligently interprets threats
Has greater awareness of surroundings
? Can target foes based on criteria determined by the engineer
-proximity
-threat level (programmable?) Ex. Spies, demomen, etc.
? Fewer or no missiles
-if the former is true, then possibly homing (to a certain extent)
? Can lock on to an enemy based on a smaller visible hitbox, i.e. to prevent
“edging”
? Will not fire upon engineer
? Possible lower upgrade level or greater metal cost
Stealth or “Trapdoor” sentry:
It is essentially an ambush sentry
Minimal or no “whirring” sound when building
Invisible when not firing
Lockon range is significantly smaller than firing range; the sentry
waits for
a victim then opens fire while the target
struggles to get out of
firing range
Only T1 or T2 upgrade level
Not reloadable nor repairable, but sappers can still be removed
Possibly flame-based
? Low health
? “decloak” time (could vary depending on gameplay balance issues)
? Conditions while setting up gun (invisible/visible, health level)
- Dispenser: Stealth dispenser:
Invisible- highly clandestine ammo and health distribution device
Significantly lower health
Buildable cover
A wall-like structure that can be built to provide cover for teammates
Destructable by enemy but has extremely high health
Not susceptible to EMP (see pistol replacement)
? Non-upgradeable
NOTE: Possible tool for griefers. Modifying environments may conflict
with map design philosophy
- Teleporter: Quantum teleporter
Can instantaneously teleport multiple people
Entrance similar to stock teleporter entrance
Due to unstable propulsion method, (cross-dimensional entanglement
manipulation) teleportees are spat out at different
locales instead of
a specific point
Exit locale determined by exit beacon
NOTE: Possible tool for griefers. In order to not teleport people
who
simply walk across it and do not wish to be
teleported, a player may
have to be immobile or somehow
activate it if he/she wish to be
teleported.
? Slow entrance build time
? Fast or instantaneous exit beacon placement
Two-way teleporter
Fairly self-explanatory. Identical to stock teleporter except that
each end
works an entrance and an exit.
Slower recharge time, or possibly limited to T1/T2 upgrade
Demolish PDA-
Destroys all or a number of player’s buildings
Can destroy buildings that are being sapped
The proposed items above are by no means a buff; there are so many
factors involved in the Engineer class that can be carefully weighed to
balance out new weapons and buildings.
Any constructive criticism welcome!
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It's a bad idea to have unlocks that counter specific classes. The Spy and Demoman are supposed to be two of the Engi's counters Honestly, I would just like a Sentry that build in about 3 seconds, couldn't be upgraded, had less firepower than a Lvl.1 but more defense than a Lvl.3. This would make it assist the team in combat, but wouldn't completely prevent an enemy team from attacking
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Good point.
The engineer's ability to counter those classes should be based on how much of a problem they normally step outside their boundaries of effectiveness against a sentry. That is, to what extent are demomen and spies overpowered (OP in the truest sense) against a sentry should be the basis of the unlock's design.
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They're trying to make the engie more viable for competitive play, so maybe a jetpack?
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What I'd put:
Shotgun Alternate - Gravelium Launcher Rifle (bit of a TF2 backstory joke for those that remember)
Launches Super Heavy Giant (size of a brick) Slugs of Gravelium at Enemies.
+ Long Range
+ Very Accurate if Aimed Well
+ Arcs
-- Arcs
-- Reload after every shot
-- Less ammo/uses metal?
Pistol Alternate - Electro Dartgun
Shoots supercharged electric darts that create a temporary trap that slows and triggers minicrits on whoever triggers it. Can also be fired directly at opponents for a splash effect.
+ Can be used to set traps
+ Effects splash on direct attacks
+ Slows and triggers minicrits on those affected
-- Must recharge between uses
-- Traps lose their charge and die out a short while after being placed (equal to recharge time)
-- Can hit you if you're too close when the dart is triggered or hits an opponent
Wrench Alternate - Handyman Monkey Wrench
+ Builds buildings much faster
+ Steals ammo and turns it into metal on hit
-- Cannot upgrade
Sentry Alternate - Turrets
+ Can build 3 at once
+ A bit cheaper to build
+ Small
+ Much cheaper upgrades
+ Additional Range and Firepower on first upgrade
+ Explodes violently when destroyed on second upgrade (unless sapped)
-- Must be upgraded individually
-- Less firepower when upgraded
Dispenser Alternate - Reinforser (spelled that way on purpose)
+ Minicrits for those standing nearby
-- Doesn't produce metal (still gives ammo though)
Teleporter Alternates - Vertiporter and Telewarper
-- Cannot teleport between the two
Vertiporter -
+ Jump higher and take no fall damage when jumped off of
+ Upgrades increase jump height and momentum
Telewarper -
+ Teleporters you in the direction you're looking until you reach the end of it's range or reach an obstacle
+ Upgrades increase range
-- Short delay between entering and exiting warp during which you can only look around and die if the telewarper is destroyed (you see yourself moving towards the end of the warp during this time).
Building Detonator Alternate - Extra cache of metal
+ Small boost to maximum metal
-- Cannot destroy buildings (they permanently disable themselves until destroyed if you switch classes, changing your loadout back to the detonator will still not let you detonate them)
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A small remote controlled mouse type thing that can be steered by the engi from base/dispenser or something. Left-click to transform into teleporter exit.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _MrThunder_
The Engineer Update
Possible Primary/Secondary/Melee Replacements:
- Shotgun: Nail gun (possibly radioactive)
Hitting an enemy creates a particle effect, which can reveal cloaked spies
Parabolic drop on slugs, similar to needlegun
? As an enemy is hit with more nails, damage effect increases to mini-crit
then full critical
? Radioactivity decreases max health of engineer
Taunt: Engineer removes radioactive slug from tool belt, flips it like a coin,
and the places it in his nail gun
-I wouldn't use this. Shotgun is for close range, pistol is for long range. This looks like medium range.
- Pistol: Taser
On hit, briefly stuns an enemy
? Speed reduction on target
? Damage/no damage
Taunt: Same as pistol taunt
-Sandman? No.
EMP
Has short range
? Disables stickies temporarily
? Disables enemy buildings temporarily
Taunt: Engineer throws grenade up in the air and chuckles menacingly
-Maybe. Only good for engineers who build all their buildings in one place. Destroying buildings shouldn't be done by an engineer.
Designator
Laser pointer-like device that illuminates targets.
Increases range of sentry to a certain extent, allowing the sentry to hit
normally out-of-range targets.
Requires significant charge-up time (possibly aided by dispenser)
? Lights up disguised spies for sentry to target
Taunt: Engineer places device on ground, makes it do a light show, then
does his shotgun taunt dance
-Does the sentry always shoot at the laser? If so, great (just don't light up spies). Prevents Edging and Increases range in exchange for the pistol.
Six-shooter
Well-aimed shot can knock a sapper off a building
Slow rate of fire
? No damage falloff
? No critical hit
Taunt: Good candidate for a deadly taunt
-Looks viable. If it is like the ambassador, with sapper removal instead of headshot, yes please.
- Wrench: [wrench type]
Carries more metal
Upgrades buildings slower
? Speeds up build time more
More metal is actually very interesting. Since metal is gained in percentages, this decreases # of ammo boxes needed. Viable.
[wrench type]
Carries less metal
Upgrades buildings faster
? Speeds up build time less
I would only use it as a support engineer.
Build PDA- Here have been considered some replacements for the engie’s existing
buildings.
- Sentry: Smart sentry
Intelligently interprets threats
Has greater awareness of surroundings
? Can target foes based on criteria determined by the engineer
-proximity
-threat level (programmable?) Ex. Spies, demomen, etc.
? Fewer or no missiles
-if the former is true, then possibly homing (to a certain extent)
? Can lock on to an enemy based on a smaller visible hitbox, i.e. to prevent
“edging”
? Will not fire upon engineer
? Possible lower upgrade level or greater metal cost
Too complicated. Also, destroying stickies after looking at them for a second should be considered.
Stealth or “Trapdoor” sentry:
It is essentially an ambush sentry
Minimal or no “whirring” sound when building
Invisible when not firing
Lockon range is significantly smaller than firing range; the sentry waits for
a victim then opens fire while the target struggles to get out of
firing range
Only T1 or T2 upgrade level
Not reloadable nor repairable, but sappers can still be removed
Possibly flame-based
? Low health
? “decloak” time (could vary depending on gameplay balance issues)
? Conditions while setting up gun (invisible/visible, health level)
Interesting, but still complicated. Very good for ninjaneering.
- Dispenser: Stealth dispenser:
Invisible- highly clandestine ammo and health distribution device
Significantly lower health
If not invisible to teammates, good.
Buildable cover
A wall-like structure that can be built to provide cover for teammates
Destructable by enemy but has extremely high health
Not susceptible to EMP (see pistol replacement)
? Non-upgradeable
NOTE: Possible tool for griefers. Modifying environments may conflict
with map design philosophy
Cover is really only needed by snipers, spies, and engineers. All others generally dodge, airblast, or rocket/sticky jump.
- Teleporter: Quantum teleporter
Can instantaneously teleport multiple people
Entrance similar to stock teleporter entrance
Due to unstable propulsion method, (cross-dimensional entanglement
manipulation) teleportees are spat out at different locales instead of
a specific point
Exit locale determined by exit beacon
NOTE: Possible tool for griefers. In order to not teleport people who
simply walk across it and do not wish to be teleported, a player may
have to be immobile or somehow activate it if he/she wish to be
teleported.
? Slow entrance build time
? Fast or instantaneous exit beacon placement
Slow recharge time should be included. It seems like this is good for helping the team reach the front lines due to respawn waves, but not good for stragglers.
Two-way teleporter
Fairly self-explanatory. Identical to stock teleporter except that each end
works an entrance and an exit.
Slower recharge time, or possibly limited to T1/T2 upgrade
Probably the best proposal here. Very simple, and changes gameplay. Slower recharge time, with full upgrades, is best, because upgrading buildings is part of being an engineer.
Demolish PDA-
Destroys all or a number of player’s buildings
Can destroy buildings that are being sapped
Destroying all buildings should never be done. Those last few seconds between destroy-building the sentry and then destroy-building the dispenser could save that scout's life.
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That wold make sense because it would allow the engie to access places that would normally require a dispenser jump. This ability would give the engie more of an opportunity to utilize terrain and break the cycle of mindless turtling.
Shotty replacement?
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i would like a sentry that is hidden. Like On the ceiling, or under the ground. So when an enemy walks throw the door way, a sentry can pop up or hang from the ceiling and catch them by surpris As an advantage for spies, when ever anyone comes through the door, enemy or friendly, the sentry will pop up. This gives the spy the ability to sap it still
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